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by CeCeDville
on Wed Aug 12, 2009 12:17 pm |
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Last edited by CeCeDville on Thu Aug 13, 2009 6:16 am; edited 2 times in total |
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CeCeDville
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by garhkal
on Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:21 pm |
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Not to sound negative, but why would us fellow smokers sign a petition to ban smoking? I know where you are coming from, but outlawing it in appartments is just one step towards giving them the idea/precident to force it being outlawed in your own homes (just in case you have people of that same classification).
And for one, i am wholely against any more bans. |
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garhkal
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by flex
on Wed Aug 12, 2009 6:10 pm |
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Quote: in an apartment complex it should be banned I feel...
WHAT?
The latest push in Canada from the nico nazi movement is for a smoking ban in multi dwelling units, such as apartment and condominium complexes. Nursing homes bans was an issue a few years back. Banned now. Some government controlled, rent to income geared and other multi dwelling units already banned smoking INSIDE of people homes and a well organized and funded drive making more progress.
Ever more progress.
The reason I post in this forum, because Canada as a country is way ahead of the "ban success" than the US overall and in general. It should serve as a red flag or warning sign to areas of the US, where the "good
doers", "children protectors", "helpers of smokers", "well meaning health professionals", "nonsmokers rights advocates" and..................., not yet able to nearly extinguish rights of smokers.
Been involved in this issue for many years, aware of the "success" stories in some parts in the US of tobacco control but there is a reason the WHO consider Canada to be " the shining example of success"
for its tobacco control agenda.
Going back to the petition in question; it is a call for a blanket ban as far as I can see it.
As previous poster pointed it out, a step toward a ban in homes.
Had my fair share of hearing "reasonable request", followed by "polite demands", followed by bans galore with no exception.
No need for a blanket ban for the 85 year old and the petition in question simply asking for that.
Personally know more than 1 person on oxygen living in apartment buildings without a blanket smoking ban without any problem. Their unit is smoke free, so is the common element areas inside of the building but not in other units or outside areas.
WHY IS THIS PETITION DEMANDING A BLANKET BAN ?
On the bottom of the petition in question;
Quote: Petition to Meridian Group Inc. was created by Concerned Citizens and written by Larissa Liedl (laceys_lnt@hotmail.com).
Is that You "CeCeDville"?
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by smallbird
on Wed Aug 12, 2009 10:46 pm |
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I do not want to seem unsympathetic either. That said...I will NEVER sign a petition to ban smoking legal products anywhere. It is unconstitutional!
Besides that, oxygen is an accelerant, it does NOT CAUSE fires. |
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smallbird
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by flex
on Thu Aug 13, 2009 7:51 am |
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Interesting.
"CeCeDville" ; edited the post twice since my post and now removed the link to the petition.
The target of the petition was a Chippewa Falls apartment complex and Larissa Liedl, whose name appeared on the bottom of the petition attended the Chippewa Falls High school and now attending the University of Wisconsin.
That was the reason I asked "CeCeDville" if it was the same person.
The smoking residents of the apartment complex in question will probably face a blanket ban, there seems to be no room for compromises for smokers anymore.
Hope the result will not be as heartless as it happened here, where laws first made it financially impossible for nursing homes to have indoor smoking areas than laws ensured that smokers can not be protected from the elements outside either. A roof to protect from rain or provide shade was just too much to ask for those who was able to go outside. Far enough, of course.
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by CeCeDville
on Thu Aug 13, 2009 10:05 am |
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I'm worried about the elderly people in the community. Do not come at me like im doing something wrong by promoting this. If you don't care about senior citizens thats fine, thats your opinion, but I do and I'm concerned for their health.
If you would realize I am NOT against smoking (I SMOKE) , but I AM against in a complex that houses elderly people. Its much worse for their health than mine.
If you don't agree with it, thats fine but there is no reason to bash what I'm doing like I'm some Non Smoking Rights Activist. I'm not, I'm just someone will a concern for peoples grandmas and grandpas.
I removed my post because it obviously got you all worked up and I apologize that wasnt my intentions, i was just looking for some smokers that like smoking, but are for protect our senior citizens in their old age.
Good job Googling Larissa too? Whats that have to do with anything
Sorry for getting you upset, was not my intentions whatsoever. Have a great Day! |
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CeCeDville
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by flex
on Thu Aug 13, 2009 12:00 pm |
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Got me worked up? You sound to be far more upset than me.
Having said that, those of Us who has been actively involved defending the rights of smokers came across more than a few "under handed" tactics used by some who are determined to take away all Our rights.
This was Your first post and was asking Us to sign and ask Our friends to sign a petition for what it appears to be a blanket ban for smoking in that complex, which in fact could and would take away the right of every resident as well as employee in that complex to smoke anywhere.
Quote: If you don't care about senior citizens thats fine, thats your opinion, but I do and I'm concerned for their health.
Making it sound like people do not care about senior citizens just because the petition You posted on this site is apparently does not appeal to some for reasons stated does not make that statement to be true. As a matter of fact, the reason I posted on this subject because I do care about them.
Cared enough to drive more than an hour to partake in a protest a few years back when the smoking bans was introduced here which basically forced senior citizens out of their home during winter and without the benefit of any protection from the elements.
Btw, that was the reason why I bothered to ask You if it was You whose name appeared on the bottom of the petition. It was also the reason I bothered to Googling up Larissa.
I simply felt that a person should get in touch with a charity called 2CL who can provide some info, as well as pictures of a result of a blanket ban have on seniors who smoke.
Have a great day.
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by Slearwig
on Thu Aug 13, 2009 5:26 pm |
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| Maybe we should start a petition in opposition to the ban. |
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Slearwig
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by gilster
on Thu Aug 13, 2009 8:37 pm |
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I see what's happening:
http://chippewa.com/articles/2009/08/09/news/doc4a7c6f34a9f12012602300.txt
The apartment complex had a fire last Thursday night and it apparently was started by a cigarette:
Quote: Richard Hall, 49, told Chippewa Falls firefighters that he likely fell asleep while smoking a cigarette on his living room couch.
You know that most people who "fall asleep" and start a fire with a cigarette ember are DRUNK.
So I would suggest that you ban drinking to excess in the apartment complex - the best way would be to ration all alcohol intake to 2 drink units per day - to equal 14 units per week. You will have some people who will hoard their alcohol and bribe the tea-totallers with pastry to get their allocations - but you need to stamp your feet and stop this......
Quote: Romeis Millstream is owned by Future Wisconsin, a non-profit corporation. It also has a second 61-unit apartment complex at 607 N. High Street.
“We’re thankful the fire systems worked,” said Strub, adding that it was his understanding the fire alarms were all activated. The apartments do not have an automatic sprinkler or fire suppression system.
Well, there's your problem right there - no automatic sprinklers or fire suppression systems. What you need to do is go to the town or county and get them to raise homeowners taxes to retrofit the apartments for safety - apparently the non-profit corporation doesn't give a damn about their tenants.
Also, make sure to write in your petition to ban candles by these tenants, drunk tenants knock over candles too. Also any type of BBQ equipment unless it's, Oh, 50 feet away from any windows or doors, just in case people who are signing this thing want no smoke to be smelled -smoke is smoke. |
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gilster
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by flex
on Fri Aug 14, 2009 5:29 am |
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There is some odd and unusual thing about this story as it was reported;
Quote: Richard Hall, 49, told Chippewa Falls firefighters that he likely fell asleep while smoking a cigarette on his living room couch.
Likely fell asleep?
As pointed out, nearly all fires caused by people who fell asleep while smoking are drunk.
Of course, candles burning, fireplaces and even kitchen stoves left on can cause a fire when left unattended.
[quote
Romeis Millstream is owned by Future Wisconsin, a non-profit corporation. It also has a second 61-unit apartment complex at 607 N. High Street.
“We’re thankful the fire systems worked,” said Strub, adding that it was his understanding the fire alarms were all activated. The apartments do not have an automatic sprinkler or fire suppression system.
The complex in question and an other 61 unit complex with no automatic sprinkler or even fire suppression system.
YES; THERE IS A NEED FOR ACTION.
The overwhelming majority of fires in apartment buildings caused by electrical wiring.
A blanket ban of smoking should not be the issue here. Aside from the fact that it surely will be ignored by some who may even start to use scented candles regularly, it is simply ignoring the real problem.
Stoves, candles, fireplaces, b.b.q, heaters, cigarettes, matches, arson are some of the things I can think of at the moment can also start a fire.
Faced with a pressure due to a petition to DO SOMETHING, which specifically target smoking, owners and politicians tend to look for the cheapest "solution" available. A few NO SMOKING signs cost a few dollars. Compare that to the cost of a retrofit.
Quote:
Resident Dawn Sanders said Thursday night that she was first aware that something was amiss some time before the fire was reported.
She said she was out by the picnic tables along High Street an hour or more before the fire was first noticed, and claims she smelled smoke.
“As soon as I went inside and through the second door I said, ‘Good God, it stinks,’” Sanders said.
She said she reported the burning smell and was told the smell was coming from a cigarette can near the front of the building.
The odd and unusual statement I made is a reference to this part of the story.
Of course it may mean nothing.
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