NC smoking ban

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by pallmallit on Sat Jan 02, 2010 12:46 am

I want to know how other smokers in NC feel about the new law and what if anything can we do to fight this unfair invasion of our personal freedoms? I also am tired of being looked down upon and being discriminated against just because I enjoy a smoke, double that with an unfair tax on smokers that benefits nonsmokers. Seems like to me that is unfair taxation without any representation. Who in congress is standing up for my rights? I can answer that myself no one is standing up for us smokers. We are a minority and our rights and personal freedoms are being trampled on. We are being discriminated against and are being sought out by fascist neo cons to spew their hatred upon us. This is just a preview of coming attractions of dictatorship of Obama and the rest of the dumbocrats. It is Time to boot these fascist out this year and again in 2012. I want my freedom back.

Last edited by pallmallit on Sat Jan 02, 2010 2:08 am; edited 1 time in total

pallmallit Newbie

Newbie Joined: Oct 31, 2009 Posts: 8

by runamok on Sat Jan 02, 2010 2:01 am

pallmallit wrote:

I want to know how other smokers in nc feel about the new law and what if anything can we do to fight this unfair invasion of our personal freedoms?

Welcome pallmallit

If the citizens of a locale that is being targeted for a smoking ban don't begin getting organized until it is up for a vote by the lawmakers, it is way too late to fight it. Even if you did get a head start you'd be fighting an uphill battle that you would probably lose. Anti-smoking has grown dangerously powerful over the last 10 years or so. They have everthing going in their favor right now. The phony science claims that are trotted out to the media on a regular basis are sucked up as gospel by the vast majority, many smokers included.

There's really very little that can be done at this point. The only thing that might be effective would be civil disobedience on a large scale but that is a pipe dream. Seems it's impossible to get a sufficient number of business owners to join the rebellion and stick to their principles. Maybe NC is different but I'd be very surprised (and thrilled) if a revolt was ever organized and implemented. Hasn't happened anywhere else.

runamok

Smoking Lobby Sponsor Joined: Dec 20, 2004 Posts: 1288

by pallmallit on Sat Jan 02, 2010 2:31 am

runamok wrote:

pallmallit wrote:

I want to know how other smokers in nc feel about the new law and what if anything can we do to fight this unfair invasion of our personal freedoms?

Welcome pallmallit

If the citizens of a locale that is being targeted for a smoking ban don't begin getting organized until it is up for a vote by the lawmakers, it is way too late to fight it. Even if you did get a head start you'd be fighting an uphill battle that you would probably lose. Anti-smoking has grown dangerously powerful over the last 10 years or so. They have everything going in their favor right now. The phony science claims that are trotted out to the media on a regular basis are sucked up as gospel by the vast majority, many smokers included.

There's really very little that can be done at this point. The only thing that might be effective would be civil disobedience on a large scale but that is a pipe dream. Seems it's impossible to get a sufficient number of business owners to join the rebellion and stick to their principles. Maybe NC is different but I'd be very surprised (and thrilled) if a revolt was ever organized and implemented. Hasn't happened anywhere else.

Thanks runamok
That's why I came to this site to see how others in this state and others as well feel about this new law that is being implied upon us. This is ironic because
a lot of North Carolina's got rich off of tobacco and Duke Hospital was founded by a rich tobacco farmer. If it was not for tobacco there would have been no Duke Hospital.

That's just what I would like to do get a rebellion going in NC.
But I don't know if we have any rebels here anymore with with any guts left.

pallmallit Newbie

Newbie Joined: Oct 31, 2009 Posts: 8

by gilster on Sat Jan 02, 2010 7:57 am

Pallmallit, welcome to the lobby!

At this point in the downward spiral, the only suggestion I have is to join a Tea Party group in your area.

While the tea party movement is not about 'smokers rights' it IS about citizen rights and property rights - a mixture of people and ideologies - both republican and democrat leaning citizens (with many Libertarians)- upset at where this country is going - SOCIALISM......

gilster

Smoking Lobby Sponsor Joined: Apr 19, 2006 Posts: 1214

by runamok on Sat Jan 02, 2010 9:51 am

There is one more path that could be explored.

South Dakota passed a ban but some ambitious citizens, backed mostly by the Deadwood casinos, put together a successful petition drive to put in on the ballot in the November, 2010 elections. They had one hell of a fight on their hands (mostly due to the American Cancer Society) just getting the petition finally validated but they did it. My personal feeling is that the SD ban will get kicked to the curb in a very close vote but it's going to be a bloody battle as anti-smoking will be pulling out all the stops come September or so. The propaganda on the airwaves in SD will be so thick you could cut it with a knife.

I certainly don't know what the laws are concerning this sort of thing in NC but it may be worth looking into if you are serious about doing something. I've considered doing the same here in MN but we are just behind CA when it comes to nannying liberals per capita.

runamok

Smoking Lobby Sponsor Joined: Dec 20, 2004 Posts: 1288

by libertarian99 on Sat Jan 02, 2010 3:38 pm

I don't live in North Carolina, but I'm equally perplexed about how antismoking legislation just rolls through the democratic process with little or no opposition. The legislation rarely makes headlines and most smokers seem to be unaware that a coordinated global effort is moving forward like a steamroller to eradicate personal freedom in favor of government nannyism.

I don't know how it all works in individual states because I only recently caught onto the global initiative myself. But if you pay attention to the news from countries like Canada, Australia and the UK, where the antismoking initiative is further advanced, you can see what could be ahead for North Carolina.

Here's a link to an interesting editorial about antismoking legislation in the UK:

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/edwest/9638527/why_do_taxpayers_fund_the_antismoking_lobby/

Partial quote from the article:

"...But that’s not the real story. The real issue is that big government and the welfare-health industrial complex have corrupted democracy in their pursuit to rid England of tobacco.

The advert yesterday claimed that “opinion polls show public support for these measures”, which reminded me of the Devil’s Kitchen’s post from earlier this year, which commented on an article from this newspaper back in January.

The Government has been accused of fixing the outcome of public consultations on health policy after it emerged that reviews were flooded with block votes from groups funded entirely by the taxpayer.

Earlier this month the Health Secretary, Alan Johnson, announced that the display of cigarettes and tobacco in shops would be banned in England and Wales from 2011.

He added that people wanting to buy cigarettes from vending machines would in future have to show proof of age to obtain a token to activate the machine, and machines could be banned altogether in the future.

Mr Johnson boasted that the display ban was favoured by an “overwhelming majority” of 96,000 responses to a six-month public consultation on the subject. Yet only a handful of those 96,000 respondents came from individuals submitting their personal views. Almost 70,000 came from those collected by pressure groups entirely funded by the Department for Health...”

* * *

libertarian99 Enthusiastic Smoker

Enthusiastic Smoker Joined: May 01, 2009 Posts: 453

by Scratinthehat on Mon Jan 04, 2010 8:09 pm

Resistance is not futile!

I’m not a smoker but I argued this case here,

http://www.salisburypost.com/News/010110-Smoking-Sidebar

And here,

http://www.salisburypost.com/News/010110-Smoking-last-day-before-ban

In the Salisbury post.

What smokers need to do is the same kind of crap they pull on you. Businesses are not going to do anything because they have everything to lose. So where is the Achilles heel on this issue? Enforcement! Form a gorilla network and go out in force to the banned areas and smoke. Then vanish like smoke after the Nazis have been called. Put on Groucho Marx masks and most of the time you could have only 20% really smoking. The rest could just be blowing out something that looked like smoke. That gives all of you a “who did what” defense if you ever were caught. I already have a name for this resistance. The Gorilla Smoking Network! You’ve seen what has been done in Iran through Twitter and other media. Show the state what it is to be a group of individuals! Resist!
Very Happy

Scratinthehat Newbie

Newbie Joined: Jan 04, 2010 Posts: 1

by Kurt Davenport on Tue Jan 05, 2010 11:55 pm

Briefly: The recent law passed against smoking in many places is "BULL" Why can't a person smoke while playing pool at a "Pool Hall" that happens to serve Beer.

This State of North Carolina is VERY STUPID and eventually will pay the price in lost revenue !!!!

STUPID DUMB BUTTS.........[/i]

Kurt Davenport Newbie

Newbie Joined: Jan 05, 2010 Posts: 1

by infinitethoughts on Wed Jan 06, 2010 1:26 pm

pallmallit wrote:

I want to know how other smokers in NC feel about the new law and what if anything can we do to fight this unfair invasion of our personal freedoms?

Here's one thing you can do, it's not the final say but will have some impact.

Round up the local bar owners and let them know that IF someone smokes in their tavern, AND they are under full compliance (with the necessary "no smoking" signs) they are NOT liable.

The reason WHY is, it's not the Tavern owners responsiblity to enforce Statute's, it's the states job. Enforcement of Statutes is the states job, not a private business owners. All they have to do is be compliant.
The state will try and fine the Tavern owner, (for doing THEIR job, the states, by the way), but this will not hold up in a court of law.

You are a Live human Being and not a "Legal fiction" as all Courts want you to believe.

Now. Here's where it gets even better. If a smoker is fined inside the Tavern, the smoker can easily get out of the fine. How is this possible ? This stuff is a huge learning curve so they best way to explain it is:

When summoned to court for a Statute violation (not a law violation) you ask the Judge:

--Who is the injured party ? The Judge will answer The State of (Insert your State)

Because all Courts base their rules on "Legal Fictions" (fiction as in, not true.) The "state" is a legal fiction.

1. How can you put a legal fiction on the stand ? Only live human beings can be put on the stand.
2. How can a legal fiction be harmed ? Only a live human being can be harmed.

Here's a primer on the huge subject on how to gain your rights back. There's a lot to learn but worth it.

Finally if you do go to court make sure you are well informed with this material.

infinitethoughts Smoker

Smoker Joined: Mar 14, 2007 Posts: 155

by garhkal on Wed Jan 06, 2010 6:29 pm

Thanks for that tip.

garhkal

Enthusiastic Smoker Joined: Apr 24, 2009 Posts: 278

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