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by runamok
on Wed Sep 23, 2009 12:39 pm |
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crackerjack wrote: ...we need to concentrate on fighting battles that we can actually win.
In case you haven't noticed, we have no friends in the press, no friends on the right, no friends on the left, no friends in the middle, and no money. The ACLU won't touch the smoker discrimination issue with a ten foot pole and the majority of smokers have been shamed to the point that most side with anti.
There are no battles we can win. We can gather all the ammunition we want but we don't have a gun to shoot it with. Forces International has very extensive records and archives about the fraud and the money trail....have for years....but they are called fanatics and fringe lunatics by the very groups named above.
All we can do is wait around for the collision between anti-smoking and gov't's heavy reliance on tobacco tax revenue. The feds and the states are not going to put up with much in the way of reduced tobacco tax revenue. Even most anti-smoking organizations depend on brisk cigarette sales for their salaries, benefits, cars, and conventions in Miami.
The war on tobacco is a paradox that has to eventually consume itself. I hate waiting around for this to happen but I really don't see any other options. |
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runamok
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by crackerjack
on Wed Sep 23, 2009 12:58 pm |
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runamok wrote: crackerjack wrote: ...we need to concentrate on fighting battles that we can actually win.
In case you haven't noticed, we have no friends in the press, no friends on the right, no friends on the left, no friends in the middle, and no money. The ACLU won't touch the smoker discrimination issue with a ten foot pole and the majority of smokers have been brainwashed to the point that most side with anti
Well yes we are not wanted like I said before the world...want's you and me to stop smoking and they are very motivated and organized.
You can't win so long as you go out and say "I'm a smoker I have a right to smoke and you just have to put up with me" This falls on deaf ears.
What we need to do is bring to light what the extinction of the tobacco industry as a whole will do to everybody.
You start talking about having to raise 200 + billion more in taxes from those who never (80%)or no longer (20%) smoke and you will be heard.
The ACLU has nothing to do with this BTW |
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crackerjack
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by bob_kemp
on Wed Sep 23, 2009 12:59 pm |
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Hi --
Lol, you forget, I have many pounds of homegrown and don't buy tobacco any more. Well, I might buy or trade some leaf from friends who also grow, but that's all!
Thanks for the link, I will certainly use it in my activist anti-anti-smoking rants in the future!
Bob |
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bob_kemp
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by Pete Gatti
on Wed Sep 23, 2009 1:32 pm |
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bob_kemp wrote: hi --
Pete Gatti, you said "By the way, I meant to ask you, how are you shredding your tobacco?"
Thanks for the detailed explanation Bob. Thus far I've resigned myself to doing by hand as well. But instead of using rocks, I'm going to make a wooden press mold and apply pressure with a hugh vise my brother gave me. And instead of a box-cutter, I have a Chinese cleaver that is incredibly sharp.
They say necessity is the mother of invention. Maybe someday I'll invent a simple shredder and publish the plans on all the smoking sites. |
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Pete Gatti
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Location: Dade City, Florida
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by bob_kemp
on Wed Sep 23, 2009 1:42 pm |
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Hi --
Pete, if you are shredding for cigs, you will find that 1 mm shreds are hard to get with a razor. I doubt any cleaver will do it. Try both and see what happens.
The press mold will help a lot. I'll likely build one myself if I find some oak planks to use. I can get angle-iron cheap enough and have the vises. Most I've seen are using two vises.
Bob |
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bob_kemp
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by Pete Gatti
on Wed Sep 23, 2009 1:52 pm |
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runamok wrote: All we can do is wait around for the collision between anti-smoking and gov't's heavy reliance on tobacco tax revenue. The feds and the states are not going to put up with much in the way of reduced tobacco tax revenue. Even most anti-smoking organizations depend on brisk cigarette sales for their salaries, benefits, cars, and conventions in Miami.
The war on tobacco is a paradox that has to eventually consume itself. I hate waiting around for this to happen but I really don't see any other options.
Yes, I see it happening the same way. It's like a disease that has to run its course. |
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Pete Gatti
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by Pete Gatti
on Wed Sep 23, 2009 2:06 pm |
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bob_kemp wrote: Hi --
Pete, if you are shredding for cigs, you will find that 1 mm shreds are hard to get with a razor. I doubt any cleaver will do it. Try both and see what happens.
The press mold will help a lot. I'll likely build one myself if I find some oak planks to use. I can get angle-iron cheap enough and have the vises. Most I've seen are using two vises.
Bob
This isn't a cleaver like those used for chopping meat. It's more like a thin knife shaped like a cleaver and as sharp as a razor.
You should be able to find oak planks at Home Depot or Lowes, but it won't be cheap. |
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Pete Gatti
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Joined: Mar 26, 2009
Posts: 214
Location: Dade City, Florida
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by runamok
on Thu Sep 24, 2009 6:48 am |
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crackerjack wrote: What we need to do is bring to light what the extinction of the tobacco industry as a whole will do to everybody.
You start talking about having to raise 200 + billion more in taxes from those who never (80%)or no longer (20%) smoke and you will be heard.
Talking about it to who? What vehicle do you propose we use to deliver that message to the masses?
Even if you could get it out there, the retort will be all about how we will save that much, and more, in lower health care expenses.
This round of anti-smoking sentiment and legislation is not unprecedented by any means. History is riddled with it since Colombus brought it to Europe from the New World.
Anti-smoking is a parasite that will ultimately be forced to feed upon itself. |
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runamok
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by joeshmoe
on Thu Sep 24, 2009 8:34 am |
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I believe w/ out the people who smoke, a lot will
loose their jobs and etc.The tobacco industry has been a good revenue
generating industry for the past centuries. |
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joeshmoe
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by bob_kemp
on Thu Sep 24, 2009 9:08 am |
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Hi --
What can roughly 71 million tobacco users in America do to stop this attack on us? Why, we can refuse to accept such a load of guilt that we won't stand up to the bastards, that's what!
We can write letters to editors of newspapers complaining about unequal treatment under the law.
We can complain that our tax money is being used to demonize over 27% of the population. When less than 14% of the population, the blacks, were abused, did they get protection? They were only being put in the back of the bus! We are being thrown OFF the damn bus! Then, charged for a ticket anyhow!
We can point out that the science of secondhand smoke injuring someone is faulty at best, missing in action at worse, and that they are ignoring their own studies showing that it harms nobody.
http://www.nycclash.com/CaseAgainstBans/OSHA.html#OSHA
Using EPA figures on the emissions per cigarette of everything measurable in secondhand smoke, they compared them to OSHA's PELs.
As for secondhand smoke in the air, OSHA has stated outright that:
"Field studies of environmental tobacco smoke indicate that under normal conditions, the components in tobacco smoke are diluted below existing Permissible Exposure Levels (PELS.) as referenced in the Air Contaminant Standard (29 CFR 1910.1000)...It would be very rare to find a workplace with so much smoking that any individual PEL would be exceeded."
-Letter From Greg Watchman, Acting Ass't Sec'y, OSHA, To Leroy J Pletten, PHD, July 8, 1997
We can slam them with the facts. We can organize smoke-ins. We can act!
I will not go silently to my doom. I will scream to high Heaven!
Join protest organizations. Make your voice heard. Call up local radio shows and suggest that more people shuold try smoking to see if they like it! It's not too late to start smoking again!
I run into this time and time again as I sell my seeds and tobacco transplants and people act as though I'm peddling a path to Hell. OH NO! I WOULD NEVER GROW THAT!!!
Ok, there's my rant.
Bob |
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